Ginny,

I ain't a lawyer (on the up side G.W. can't fire me) so this is just my 
opinion.

Humor
Who in their right mind would even attempt to use humor on the list? I can't 
imagine such a thing. Foreshame we are all professionals here (well we are 
still discussing Larry. 1972? really? WOW!). So subjective and yeah it 
almost always ends up biting ya. Bu hey, good humor is an artform and art is 
meant to create controversy. So wht the heck.

Who owns the email?

Well that really sounds liek a John question, but Like Peter always does, 
I'll take a stab at it. In the old days (like back in 1972) mail was 
delivered by hand (Pony express I think). When a letter was sent ownership 
stayed with the author (I could be wrong about that if I am I hope any 
future employers are understanding). Now we get to the assumptions.

Is email the same as a letter sent by mail? I Think (therefore I am) that 
email is for functional purposes the same (help me John you red that legal 
book what do it say?) if email is the same then the owner has certain 
rights, and should be able to control future publication. we are of course 
assuming that posting to the list is publishing (WOW! I better update my 
resume to account for all the publishing I have done. oh wait do I want 
future employers to read my postings oh me oh my). If (if) the posting are 
considered published they entre the public domain. Fair use allows for us to 
have a copy (or does it dang you Lewinsky for distracting Congress and 
allowing them to pass such a rediculous fair use law) Keep in mind as you 
use the pearls of wisdom cast before us (boy am I going to hear about that 
one, ouch! that hurt) taht you should cite your source. Rick Barry always 
let me know when he was going to use any of my whimsical and less that 
knowledgeable observations. That can protect you to a degree (dang you 
Lewsinsky).

Deleting the list

Boy what a thought (admit it everyone of you has hoped fo rit at one time or 
another, probably half way through this posting). I don't know if you can 
delete the list. We assume that the list is a body of loose ramblings of 
crotchety old RM'ers that have been hanging around since the days of Nixon. 
And mabe SAA can argue that the list is coparable to a bulletine board. Hmm, 
but if we say hat emails are records, owned by the person who originated it 
(otherwise we can't continue to hold them accountable for content), and 
published to the web via a list, then I a not sure the list owners have the 
authority to pull the publications without proper knowledge, consent, and 
maybe even compensation to the authors. That is assuming that emails are 
records to begin with (hmm I wonder if I can sue them, yeah right how much 
money could an Archivist have anyway). If I am the author, I posted with the 
knowledge that I would have global exposure (even in OZ), that the 
assumption was that my wisdom (stop laughing Peter) would be there for the 
ages, I wonder if the deletion would be a breach of contract?

well I think deleting the list is a bad idea. Tarabulski's postings alone 
are worth the list (while you have a chance go read The Mad Pole's 
rightings).

Chris (Sorry Peter I forgot to delete the previous message again) Flynn




>From: "Jones, Virginia" <[log in to unmask]>
>Reply-To: Records Management Program <[log in to unmask]>
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: FW: E-mail issues WAS A&A List Archives, 1993-2006 -- So now what?
>Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 11:25:02 -0400
>
>The following two issues, raised in posts on the Archives Listserve
>about the list archives deletion, illustrate the difficulties records
>and archives practitioners face in this digital age:
>
>
>
><Perhaps that is the real problem:  those that are in charge of making
>the decisions don't have time to devote to the appraisal process.>
>
>
>
>And
>
><The chief reason people want their postings removed is to prevent
>potential employers from discovering their public peccadilloes through a
>Google search.>
>
>
>
>Also  <Currently there are two requests pending from posters who wish to
>remove their posts, one of whom is threatening legal action.>
>
>
>
>Issue 1 - no time to appraise (or cull, purge, delete, etc.) is the main
>reason many organizations do not follow rigid e-mail retention rules.
>Even if a clear and logical policy is in place, getting the individual
>users to follow that policy is difficult.  Folks just do not have or do
>not bother to take the time to make decisions about the value of the
>e-mails they receive and send and then take appropriate retention
>action.  Some folks delete most everything regardless of value, but most
>folks just keep e-mails....and keep e-mails.....and keep e-mails.  Until
>the volume is so large that it is almost impossible to find the time to
>sort through, make value decisions, and take appropriate action.
>
>
>
>Issue 2 - writing and sending e-mail before engaging one's brain is a
>legal liability not only for the writer but also for the organization
>represented by the e-mail address the writer used.  Many folks still
>shoot off a quick e-mail in anger or attempts at humor or great
>excitement without rereading what they wrote and considering its
>long-term impact before hitting the send button.  We find this an issue
>during Freedom of Information Act requests, and all we can say to the
>writer is "we told you so."  There is an excellent video from
>Commonwealth Films (www.commonwealthfilms.com
><http://www.commonwealthfilms.com/> ) called "Say What You Mean
><http://www.commonwealthfilms.com/s/1_11_45.asp> , Creating Documents:
>Writing, Speaking, Saving" that discusses how and what to put in the
>spoken or written word to prevent just these problems and the
>consequences of not engaging one's brain when writing or speaking.  We
>used this film for e-mail training and as a part of RIM Month for a
>number of years.
>
>
>
>What legal action can a writer bring to the forum where they,
>themselves, sent their written words or opinions?  I'm not a lawyer and
>perhaps there are some out there that can explain this, but I have seen
>nothing in the current or past listserve instructions or policy that
>says posts will be deleted at any time.  Therefore, in my opinion,  the
>writer is liable for what they wrote and sent to a public forum, not the
>repository of the written word.
>
>
>
>Ginny Jones
>(Virginia A. Jones, CRM, FAI)
>Records Manager
>Information Technology Division
>Newport News Dept. of Public Utilities
>Newport News, VA
>[log in to unmask]
>
>
>
>
>List archives at http://lists.ufl.edu/archives/recmgmt-l.html
>Contact [log in to unmask] for assistance

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